Mary McAdoo Harris, Lebanon, Tennessee
spk_0: 0:00
way. Welcome to the white Ice podcast, where we discuss issues of race that we've buried it under the carpet on Pretend like It's Connell and culture. You have to get back to agitating, to standing up to making a difference, to be fearless and our world. Today I'm your host. Vincent Harris will sit back and enjoy. Okay, so do you.
spk_1: 0:34
My name is Maria McAdoo Harris. I am the mother of Vincent Harris. We're here today from a celebration of my 80th birthday and just they glad to have him here. When you asked me to do this interview, I was not excited. But for what it is going to accomplish, I am honored to do whatever I can.
spk_0: 1:07
So so till everyone what you do and Wilson County 11. What's your So the unofficial position
spk_1: 1:17
at this time? I am working with a committee that is restoring one of the oldest Methodist churches within this Tennessee area, and it will become an African American museum and history center for this community. I'm also acted within my church picking, reckon United Methodist Church. It's coordinate of inclusiveness and church historian,
spk_0: 1:48
so we want to make sure we don't miss anything on this. You have been in the United Methodist Church? Are you, like,
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out of my life?
spk_0: 1:58
And so we want to kind of acknowledge that. But also, you've dealt with some of the issues and challenges within your city on racism, on how that has affected people in your generation and those after you. So one of the questions that I ask is about the challenge that we have today and also that we've had about racism. So do you think that racism still remains the most challenging issue for the church and society today?
spk_1: 2:32
I most certainly think rice is, um um he fixed our everyday living, and it has, uh, from slavery. Um, one of the things that I see that racism creates is negative. Negative attitudes toward those that are not may be capable of doing things that that could possibly do with someone helping them and that being education, jobs and just everyday living, Uh, if you, uh, burdened down with feeling like you're not as good as the next person, that can effect very much so. And I've seen both sides. My parents, huh? Worked very hard from my me and my four siblings, and it wasn't easy to have doors slammed in your face and having to go to the back door, having to drink from Oh, black only fountains and going to the back seat of the Greyhound bus. But we survived it, and, uh, I really feel good about a lot of things that are going on now. But we have a long way to go.
spk_0: 4:02
And since you've been in the church, you seen before merger on and after merger on if you were gonna rate the United Methodist Church on a scale of 1 to 10 where would you go? Would you place the church on a tree on this race? Relations?
spk_1: 4:23
Well, it's sad to say, but I'd say two or three because even with the time that I've been very active within this church and worked with our youth, uh, we have gone from the cluster meetings with other youth groups and even with adults that doesn't exist anymore. We had the Ebony and Ivory Conference every year, ingenuous, celebrating the legacy of Dr King, and I think things like that are very helpful for young people.
spk_0: 5:02
And so when we merged on, I think that that's important to know for people that they have been opportunities in times when African American churches and Anglo churches came together, especially after merger, trying to present and also to develop some better relationships. But since that time, there have been has been less emphasis on racial relations and trying to come together. So do you think that this merger has has helped or hindered potential, especially a black Methodist churches and its leaders? Has Has it has done something to kind of create, strengthen or has it as it really just kind of not helped move us forward? So how do you think that the relationship?
spk_1: 5:53
Well, I think it has done both because their opportunities that African Americans would not have gotten without the merger and this church offers so many positive things in the life off. You're not a Methodist, so, um, but even if that sometimes it seems that you don't feel included with some of the things that go on, you're not at the table for some of the things that come down to the local church. You accept it and you move on. But I feel like that it's been both
spk_0: 6:33
okay um, we've got a lot of churches that are closing with a lot of churches that are in decline. Do you have any? Um, anything's in your own mind. Your experience that may help That kind of turned the tide will help us to kind of do something to help us grow to help us at least relate to people in our community. Build a better church.
spk_1: 7:02
I think, um, we've gotten away from our Westland heritage. Um, and I feel if we oh, began to concentrate more Oh, that, uh, we would be more successful in this United Methodist Church. Oh, that makes sense.
spk_0: 7:29
Oh, yeah, and I think that if you talk about Leslie and Heritage, a lot of people sometimes associate that with some conservative movement or something that is much more fundamentalists. But the tenants of Wesley and Grace understanding the doctrine of grace and how it impacts every person's life, something that we in the church sometimes don't place enough inferences on, especially being United Methodist on guess that probably is challenged to some people because they don't know they're ignorant, too. Don't understand what Wesleyan Grace is attempting to to exhibit in people's lives. on what it does for people and bringing them to so far the same place, nobody better than anybody else. Sometimes that way get in our own way. Do you think that there have been obstacles, you know, of any obstacles that that African Americans have put in their own way and dealing with the race problem? The United Methodist Church?
spk_1: 8:45
I do. I think we have lost our connection as a people. And although we have accomplished a lot, and but we've become complacent, I think, and our leadership has weakened and it doesn't seem to be as important as it waas. When we were really struggling in the fifties and sixties, Oh, we had leaders that were there for us, and I don't think that's happening now within our community.
spk_0: 9:26
Well, so now that we are in this place on, we had and still do the organizations that were promoting not only racial justice but also to help agitate in places where we weren't at Table number one, BMC, our eyes that place that we used thio address racial justice as the gadflies agitated. Do you know anything about how if BMC are is becoming a force again? Or do they seem to have lost their their energy? A CE faras racial justice is concerned.
spk_1: 10:16
I would certainly hope that, um, the energy is being revived because we've had some great times with the with being cigar. And the last thing that we were helping to have in our church was some of the classes on strengthening the black church and that opportunity it was there. But I guess we didn't take advantage of it. And I think that has been one of the things in the last 10 years that has really hurt of African American churches. And even though maybe sometimes that the church doesn't seem to want to embrace that to move forward and to make disciples of Jesus Christ, we're gonna have to have that type of leadership.
spk_0: 11:08
Okay, well, you know, you got a lot of lot of history and you got a lot of information about the church and how it's kind of grown and not moved in a way that has included everyone and also about how we as African Americans need toe to grow and develop into that better understand one another as well as the church. Are there any ways that you can see that you could better connect with your generation on you. You say you're not a baby boomer. You're not a genetic your prior year before, that s so how do you think we could have better relationships? Because the people of your generation really were people who were part of that first movement. You were part of the civil rights movement. And so how do you think we're gonna have better authentic relationships in the church, racially, Just in connection with your own generation?
spk_1: 12:02
Well, as uh, we were talking earlier about the older of the ministry, which has just become the last two years within the Tennessee conference. Um, that being said, we've gone to several meetings, but the hospitality, Sometimes when we break going to our rooms to break different sessions, it's It's not like you are, really? Oh, won't it from the expressions from some faces that in this session and that makes conversation on the way back home? Maybe, you know, But, um, as a person in my age is, Well, just turn 80. Uh, the respect for our doubts within this system, it hasn't been one that makes you feel real good about. And I think coming together with persons of my generation and let them know that they still have wisdom and they can contribute to the younger generation. I would be very important to me.
spk_0: 13:29
Thank you. Well, the last question that I have you may have some comments you wanna make after this, but what are some things that you could share that you think would be helpful for a better outcome for black churches and black communities and leaders?
spk_1: 13:46
Well, I think we've We've lost our identity as families and even community. Oh, I feel if we can come together as a family, not just our personal families that friends and others that we have been inc in contact with over the years and just start this same conversation of how we can come together even in the small town I think we could make it about a place. But I think what? This young generation, we're gonna have to acknowledge that they are brilliant. They have a lot to contribute and we can work to Dever the order. Those of us that have done I wore ministries share what we know a little work and I think, embracing the grace of God that young people will be able to carry on as we move out. That's not a bit
spk_0: 15:09
it's for. So I really have enjoyed the conversation, and I know that there's a lot more that you probably have. We'll see later on. If you could get get back with you Somewhat more conversations, because this is gonna go on for a year. So do you have anything? That's why the closing comments you'd like to make before we close out today.
spk_1: 15:31
Well, the only thing I can say is I appreciate it. He was a someone you have made us proud and to tell me and for my 80th birthday and make it one of my happiest. I certainly appreciate having this opportunity. Um, I'm a Methodist to the core, and I love this church, but I know there's a lot we can do to make it better.
spk_0: 15:58
All right. Thank you so much for your time today. And this is Mary hairs. She is trail blazer for the, uh, city of Lebanon County Wilson in the state of Tennessee on really McAdoo phone number. We'll talk to you later. Hope you enjoyed that episode. See you next week.